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Roman's Attic's avatar

I like the term “animal advocate”

Aly's avatar
Mar 15Edited

Hey, FYI all the links in this post are broken.

Cool post, and I very much resonate with your point about focusing on the animals. I agree the word "vegan" is unfortunate in multiple ways. The biggest issue IMO being that it shares the same root as "vegetable" and connotes a diet rather than a stance against cruelty and exploitation (and thus centering the human / the lifestyle rather than the animals).

I do also see some logical gaps in your post.

> [The Liberation Pledge] isn’t just about the purity of what you _consume_, but also the purity of anything you _see_.

I haven't taken the pledge myself, but this feels like a large strawman. A more charitable interpretation is that rather than being about "purity" (someone who's taken the pledge could agree they're not "pure" and that perfection is unattainable), it's about avoiding (unintentionally) normalizing the eating of animals. You also write:

> Of course, this removes opportunities to _actually help animals_, because the only way to actually help animals is by being with non-vegans and persuading them to take animals into consideration.

But the pledge is only about avoiding sitting where others are eating animals. There are so many other opportunities to be with non-vegans, and while they're currently eating animals is probably one of the least effective opportunities to talk to them about taking animals into consideration (for multiple psychological reasons e.g. consistency/confirmation biases).

> And on that measure, the world has gotten _way_ worse for non-human animals since Anne and I stopped eating animals and co-founded a group promoting veganism. On average, every person in the United States eats more animals today than ever before in history. This is true globally as well. Those are the simple, bottom-line facts, the facts that all vegan advocates have to answer for.

This doesn't imply this is the fault of the vegan movement. What's the counterfactual? How do we know people in the US wouldn't be eating *even more* animals today if the vegan movement never existed? Vegan advocates are such a tiny % of the world, working against trillion-dollar industries that are themselves pouring countless resources into getting people to eat more animals. It's disappointing, but not really surprising, that animal liberation hasn't come yet; and I don't see a good reason to blame vegans for this, not even the vegans with ineffective strategies. Nor even the reducitarian advocates, who for some reason you don't claim also have to answer for the increasing global consumption of animals?

Anyway I could write more but should probably get back to stuff that has a higher expected value to the world :) have a good day and thanks for advocating for animals.

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